Top water set up advice

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Harpee61
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Top water set up advice

Post by Harpee61 »

Still learning here and counting the days to open water so I Thought I'd seek advice from fellow addicts. I fish from a kayak which meant two things: I can get up close and personal but I have limited space. That's why I have to have versatile set up that do a lot of things well but perhaps not perfectly. I love top water action and looking for a set up that will use spook, frogs, popper ect. I also target mostly smallies and pike in relatively open water but also largies in the slop. So here are my questions:
1) Baitcaster or spinning? Obvioulsy we all have our preference regardless of technnique but is there an advantage for either for top water? Bc might allow more precise casting but would the positionning of the hand on a spinning would allow for better control especially for frogs and walk the dog?
2) Line: I am thinking that mono would the choice because it floats. I would think that it would allow for the best action especially from light lures like frogs. And that would mean no fluro,leader. Does that matter as much on top water as perhaps the action camouglages better the line?
3) Rod lenght and action. I've seen most advice for 6'6 but without clear justification as to why it would be better then say7' or more? Is that because seeing the bite it allows for more timely hooking? And action?
Well that's where I am. If anyone has a few minutes to educate me I'd be real appreciative for your thoughts. Tight lines.
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CanBassK
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Re: Top water set up advice

Post by CanBassK »

When I fish topwater I go has Heavey duty as I can, with the exception of the rod.here is my topwater setup. I use a St.Croix mojo bass 7ft med/heavy rod (yes that's a crankbait rod) but I love the action the slightly softer tip gives me on frogs and spooks.
For the reel, I use an Abu Garcia Revo SX, I use this reel because when I flippin frogs, it's at heavy cover (mostly grass and Lily pads). This reel is super nice as it has a HUGE amount of drag, and a 7.1 to 1 ratio, so not only does it have the power and speed to keep the fish from diving into the thick stuff, but if I miss a blowup it has the speed to reel back in, and get the frog back to that spot insanely fast. In fact, on missed hook sets I can get the same bass to blow up 3 or 4 times in a VERY short period.
For line I use 25 to 30 lb braid. As I said, I fish frogs near heavy cover, and I need to know if the fish dives down into the thicker brush, or wrappes around a lilly stalk, I have the line power to wrench it out!

This is my frog setup. Hope this helps.

For the record, my walking bait, and popper setup is usually same, except I use 10 lb braid (most of the time with a leader) the problem I find with mono or floro is this; Hooksett percentage isn't always great with top water, that being said I want ZERO stretch in my line to make sure when I feel the weight of the fish, and force I apply is instantly applied on my bait. So my topwater is always braid. But like I said, due to line visibility in open water, I'll do a 1.5ft floro leader, on lighter braid, but for the thick stuff, always heavy braid for me.
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ShawnD
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Re: Top water set up advice

Post by ShawnD »

7' - 7 1/2' Rod, ( What ever you feel you can use in your kayak )
The rod will need a decent amount of backbone about 3/4 ways up .. With a soft tip, that soft tip will allow you to throw almost any topwater you want, while the backbone of rod will help when you're throwing frog in vegetation.

Reel, you could use any of them really, whatever you're comfortable with.
Personally I'd use a 7.0-1 or a 8.3-1, that fast retrieve will help you quickly reel in when you miss a blow up.
But a 6.3-1 would work just fine.

Line, I throw 50lb Powerpro, Using braid will make your setup even more versatile, this rod could be used to flip a texas rig/jig or even a Carolina rig.

I actually used this exact setup for years until I got a boat. When you're a co angler you learn to stay compact and having 6-10 different rods is a hassle.

hope that helps.

Shawn Dompierre
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http://www.ottawabassmasters.com/
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lape0019
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Re: Top water set up advice

Post by lape0019 »

When you say frog, are you talking a hollow body from or something like a Zoom horny toad or Stanley ribbit? I ask because I use different rods for each.

I use rods between 6'8 and 7'3 for these techniques, all on baitcasters mostly braid.

For buzzbaits, and poppers and horny toads, I have traditionally thrown them on mono but I may be throwing the poppers on braid this year as I my jerkbait setup is killer for my spook style baits and I will be throwing poppers around the same size. 30lb is what I use on this rod. for jerkbaits, If I need it to dive a little deeper, I will tie on a leader of flouro.
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Harpee61
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Re: Top water set up advice

Post by Harpee61 »

Thanks a lot guys for taking the time to share your thoughts. It`s interesting to see that at least one of you still finds use for mono. I`m just tempted to use it mostly because the hollow bodied frogs which is indeed what I meant are so light that I find the combo of fluro and wet braid interferes a bit with the action. But maybe I`m just looking for an excuse for not knowing how to use them well :oops:
Keep `em coming!
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TheMaverick
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Re: Top water set up advice

Post by TheMaverick »

You will not be able to efficiently pull off fishing frogs, and poppers on the same rod.
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lape0019
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Re: Top water set up advice

Post by lape0019 »

There is no reason to use Flouro for any of the techniques you are asking about. Your thought process about it is sound. The sinking flouro will drag the front of the bait down impeding its action.

I also have to agree with The Maverick as well. A frog rod has to be stout and the action and cadence differences between a popper/spook and a hollow body frog are just too big. Plus, you are going to fish the baits in different scenarios that will require different requirements of the rod. A frog will need a more stout rod and for the most part, I throw larger frogs that weigh more than enough on their own.

I refrained from listing my rods before just because it didn't really help with your questions. Knowing you've got a few Dobyns and a few nicer rods, it may help you a bit so here it goes.

Frog setup.
Dobyns Champion 735 (in some cases like heavier cover, a 736 would be better), Shimano Metanium XT (8.5:1) with 65lb braid.

Popper
Dobyns Champion 734, Shimano Curado I with 15lb mono. This works but I have other rods that would work better which is why I'll be trying something different next year. This is primarily my Spinnerbaits/buzzbait combo.

Spook (I use a Duo realis Pencil 110)
Megabass XX jerkbait special, Shimano Chronarch CI4+ and 30lb braid. I'll probably be running a 7.3:1 next year but have never had an issue with the slower ratio. This is my jerkbait rod (6'8) but for most of the summer, it'll have a pencil 110 tied to it. I'll be trying this out with Megabass Pop Maxs this year as well.

Adam.
Last edited by lape0019 on Wed Feb 08, 2017 12:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Jason Daoust
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Re: Top water set up advice

Post by Jason Daoust »

I use the gloomis frog rod model TWFR 854C,7' 1",Heavy,Fast . I have it pairs up with a shimano Calais reel, with 50 pound power pro braid. My popper and spook rod is almost the same action , Calais reel but spoiled with 17 pound mono. Because you need a versatile rod for a few different baits , the loomis frog rod would handle all the baits no problem. For a reel you can use basically any baitcaster with retrieve speed your comfortable withthat has a high drag.I would always use a baitcaster for more cranking power ,and more precise casts. For line beacause you are using it for multiple baits I would run 50 pound power pro. With that line you can tie directly to your frog or a toad, and to put a popper or topwater (spook) on it I would tie a 18 inch leader of mono 20pound, between the braid and the lure. What the mono will do is it will stop the lure from twisting / flipping and hooking the braid . It will also give it a bit of stretch in the line which you want with trebles .
Jason
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