Bass tournament anglers an opportunity is here.....

[lape0019]

Mike,

Thank you for taking the time to respond and respond the way you did. Thank you for also providing some facts on pay structure. I have to agree with Shawn that most of us responding here (probably all, but I don't know that for sure) would love nothing more than to watch Renegade grow.

As for getting out on the Larry, it'll happen sooner or later. I just don't know when. And even with a guarantee of one event being on the St. Lawrence a year, I'd have no issues with. But having two events there and then the one on the Ottawa as well downright would suck to me. My opinion is that if Renegade kept it to one of these bodies of water per year instead of all three, you'd attract more teams.

I am also very aware of why the Ottawa is on the list and what events transpired for this to happen . I don't for one minute take for granted what you guys currently do for this club. I'm just providing my thoughts on how to get membership up.

Once again Mike, thank you for taking the time to respond as well as volunteering to be the on the executive and for being the active President of the largest series around.

[orrsey]

I will also chime in as a current and relatively new member. Renegade is not an easy series to do well in as previously stated but that is the exact reason that drew me to join. I have always had the desire to compete, either in fishing or any other sport I've been in, Renegade is very competitive. I also wanted to get better, I knew I would have first hand access to guys who are better than me and what a great opportunity to learn and better myself, its more than just talking I can actually see what they are doing. I knew that I was going to have to get out of my comfort zone in order to get better. That meant getting off bodies of water I know well and diving into the unknown. As an example I'm from the Kingston area and I had previously spent 0 hours on the St Lawrence and Lake Ontario other than duck hunting. You can imagine what I was thinking going from Loughborough and Sydenham lake and pulling up in Cornwall and looking at the 5mph current going by, I might as well of been on Mars. My first time out on the St Lawrence out of Morrisburg on pre-fish I stayed out for 9 hours and didn't get a bite. While that day was frustrating I learned a pile of stuff, mostly what doesn't work, I am better for it. When you do try new water and can see improvement and start to figure small things out there is nothing more rewarding, its all part of growing as an angler and getting better in order to compete. In the mean time I am not going to be quitting because it seems to hard, to me this is just part of competing.

As for the donating comments I get it, but I will go right back to the competitive aspect of things. I am not looking for a participant ribbon, I want to earn it. When you do well in renegade you have earned it, it is very rewarding. To go in and expect to win or get in the top 10 all the time is just not realistic for myself and most others. Hopefully someday I can get there, I certainly have the fire in my belly to try.
In order to attract top tier anglers you need good payouts, in order to have good payouts its going to have to have some money coming in, so in my opinion the entry fee isn't too bad divided by 2 guys somewhere around $750 each for 5 tournaments (including classic). The other expenses your going to spend anyway no matter what tournament series your in whether it be fuel or tackle.

This is just a little of where I am coming from. I understand the uncertainty and nervousness. I was there but I am really happy I just did it. I have learned a ton and I know I am better than when I started.

Blake

[Alex Bull]

Just my two cents. I don't mean to offend, but I feel it is a worth while point.

In regards to the "donating" idea. If you are really concerned about where your money is going, then why would you fish an organization where the people putting on the event are taking a cut of the payout? Your entry fee is going right into their pocket. At least Renegade is a 100% payback. No one running the event is making money off running the series.

[cprince]

... as well as the chance to go on to qualify for the Bassmaster Classic.

Has something changed radically? Is Renagade now a defacto Bassmasters chapter?

Craig

[RJ]

... as well as the chance to go on to qualify for the Bassmaster Classic.

Has something changed radically? Is Renagade now a defacto Bassmasters chapter?

Craig

No. They are eligible to send 3 teams to the Bassmaster Team Championship. It's a one weekend deal where one guy from that tournament goes to the Bassmaster Classic.

[MichaelVandenberg]

Thanks to Shawn, Adam, Blake, Ed, Alex and RJ for the comments.

Myself and others on the RB executive are very proud on what we have created. As it has been said, we are volunteers and do this because we are passionate about fishing. Because we have nothing to gain from running Renegade Bass we make decisions to only benefit the anglers. All entries fees are paid back and then some due the generous support of our sponsors and because we pay everything back the actual number of teams does not really become a factor. Our 150 HP & Under are structured that way. There is no difference between a 2 team field or a 50 team field other than what the top placing teams can win. Money in equals money out. The series is very similar other than the fact your sign-up for 4 events and qualify for the Classic. Sure in years past we had more teams which meant it really was a real accomplishment to make the Classic. This year, it will be easier to make the Classic due to the low numbers but that is ok. There are still a few teams that will not and I can tell from a competitive stand point, no one wants to be in that group of teams.

If we had one objective that drives us is we want to get people fishing. Whether you choose to fish the RBT series, opens, Pro-AM, the kids derby, other tournaments or even just fun fishing it doesn't matter. We are very fortunate to have almost an endless opportunity right in our backyard. There are world class smallmouth, Muskie and Gar fisheries within an hour or two of Ottawa. There is way too many lakes to list that have great largemouth and crappie fishing and good Walleye fishing is not hard to find. I suppose the only thing we lack in the area is trout fishing but there is great Lake Trout opportunities near by.

We try and offer what we believe anglers want. So choose to Renegade Bass or not but at the very least choose to fish and enjoy the wonderful fisheries we have right in our backyard.

Keep it positive

Mike

[procrafter12]

Renagade was a lot of fun for me last year, the attention to detail and fish care blew me away. I should also mention we felt like real rookies too so we got our moneys worth on that. Unfortunalty this year I will not have enough time to make the most out of the season season due to other commitments. Hopefully I can return for the following year and stay on the tour for awhile after! The payout and competition is why I want to fish renagade although mid day on the st lawrence i was hoping no one else caught em either.

Out of curiosity why do tournement series not spread the season out I feel like the lakes would be less crowded and less series with conflicting dates. It would also allow for more off weekends in between tournements making the commitment easier (for me anyway).

[TheMaverick]

Out of curiosity why do tournement series not spread the season out I feel like the lakes would be less crowded and less series with conflicting dates. It would also allow for more off weekends in between tournements making the commitment easier (for me anyway).

Excellent question.

[orrsey]

I think I have seen something before about other conflicts that come with extending the tournament season. One reason is that a lot of people who fish also hunt, hunting season basically starts in September.

[TheMaverick]

I think I have seen something before about other conflicts that come with extending the tournament season. One reason is that a lot of people who fish also hunt, hunting season basically starts in September.

I didn't want to be the one to say it, but yes, that is the word.

[ShawnD]

I think I have seen something before about other conflicts that come with extending the tournament season. One reason is that a lot of people who fish also hunt, hunting season basically starts in September.

That makes sense, but not everyone hunts..
RJ's event and I would even go as far to say any event planned in the fall fills up quick.

Heck they're entire back yard tournament series that only fish the fall.

[TheMaverick]

Thanks for being concerned about being a jerk off to me MA so I'll try here too... It's not really up to ANY organisation to make you feel less like a donator, that is 100% up to you to do that. How did where you fished last year make you feel like less of a donator? I'll never forget how happy you and Pops were getting that Renegade check and also how happy guys were for you, that's what it's all about.

RJ

Within 14 qualifiers fishing Renegade, pops and I cashed out 3 cheques, with 2 top tens.
We were also guest speakers on the Renegade Bass radio show.
Once again, it’s a great series, and if we were able to do it, pretty much anyone can.

Technically speaking, you donate to a series regardless of which one you chose to enroll.
Reading the replies on this thread, we once thought the exact same way as many do on here, we wanted to see where we’d stack up against the best.
Hell, pops fished a Renegade walk on back in the days, in a 16 tin boat, 9.9 Johnson and a cooler w/ aerator for a livewell, placed midfield.

If we’re donating 500$ per team for 6 events fishing BAA, it’s roughly 40$ each per event to compete with a somewhat leveled playing field.
Or we can chose as a team, to donate 1500$ to Renegade, which is roughly 185$ each per event (4 events) to see where we’d stack up against the best.
To each their own.

You need to understand that dishing out that kinda coin is a hard decision to make when you don’t have as much time out on the water, experience, or knowledge to even come close to what the best have under their belt. It seems as though when people try to address concerns, they’re somewhat brushed off with the same constant replies about having the best payouts and prizes.

Hope I don’t get disowned with the following questions lolol but they’re often asked behind the scenes…

-Would the top tier, the best of the best, still sign up if the payouts were smaller?
-Does the series end early because they cater to the hunters?
-Why include the TIO in the renegade schedule, not every member fishes the TIO.
-Why were walk-ons denied?
-What are the 50$ initiation fee per member used for, same with the yearly team administration fee of 40$

P.S. It’s not fair to direct these questions at you RJ, I’m just posting them up for anyone to answer.

[Matt Massey]

Hey Maverick, I can comment on your questions but first I'll address the donating piece and answer your question with a question - Do you think that any one who fishes the RBT wasn't intimidated by the field, the investment or the challenge of new waters? The answer is, each and every one of the anglers (me included)made the choice to fish RBT because they wanted to fish against the best and want the challenge. Full Stop.

A few points:

Anyone who wants to fish the series is welcome, we encourage new anglers to get on board and they run Master Development Sessions in the spring to help new and seasoned anglers learn more about the waters we fish and how to be better anglers.

There is an investment made - if you consider it donating that's your mindset, not the reality. Is there a learning curve? YUP, but every single angler will need to challenge themselves to be better. Every single team in RBT will help you get better, give you tips, we want you to be as competitive as we can.

See my other answers below

Hope I don’t get disowned with the following questions lolol but they’re often asked behind the scenes…

-Would the top tier, the best of the best, still sign up if the payouts were smaller?

How would this be relevant? The series, costs and payouts are built on 22 years of hard working volunteers making RBT what it is today.

-Does the series end early because they cater to the hunters?

Probably more to do with the start of kids hockey seasons.

-Why include the TIO in the renegade schedule, not every member fishes the TIO.

THE RBT Thousand Islands Open is an open event not a qualifer and doesn't impact the Qualifier standings.

-Why were walk-ons denied?

It's a logistics nightmare - they created the 150 Open events for anglers who wan to fish an RBT event

-What are the 50$ initiation fee per member used for, same with the yearly team administration fee of 40$

This is to cover some of the costs associated with running the RBTs - insurance, maintenance, shore staff costs etc

[lape0019]

-Would the top tier, the best of the best, still sign up if the payouts were smaller?

How would this be relevant? The series, costs and payouts are built on 22 years of hard working volunteers making RBT what it is today

It's relevant because RBT can't fill a field. Even if their new goal was 60 teams, the tour still comes up 1/3 short... If the top tier weren't about to up and leave because of reduced payouts and cheaper entry fees, would the end result be more people fishing the series?

Or if you filled the field, would the extra entry fees gained even at a lower amount be able to sustain the payout structure the way it is?



-Does the series end early because they cater to the hunters?

Probably more to do with the start of kids hockey seasons.

There could be many other reasons for this as well but if you extended by one month (Held 1 qualifier and the classic in September instead of just the classic) would this drum up more members? RBT has two past members here asking that question and one stating outright it would make it easier for him to sign up so the answer here is possibly yes.


-What are the 50$ initiation fee per member used for, same with the yearly team administration fee of 40$

This is to cover some of the costs associated with running the RBTs - insurance, maintenance, shore staff costs etc

And this is more for clarification than to help but I get the Insurance and maintenance things here for certain items that RBT has (The live release boat maybe and the stage/scales?) but what costs would be associated to shore staff? This is all voluntary is it not?



I am actually happy to see this discussion go the direction it did as it shows that RBT is listening as well as quite a few people have provided some excellent input.

I hope that executive at RBT have found it useful as well.

[toobinator]

Adam: Renegade shore staff are paid and don't fish the series. This takes away the favoritism that might happen if the anglers themselves were the shore crew. The insurance is the main thing. Not just for fixed assets, but for comprehensive in case there is an accident on the water and a bystander gets injured. Renegade pays a crazy amount for insurance. Unfortunately it's the nature of the beast.

As to the lower payouts, what we have is as low as we go. If we get back up to a higher amount of participants, the payouts go up and deeper. When we were running 70 boats Renegade paid down 20 places. I had a few guys through the store over the winter saying they weren't fishing because with the lower numbers the payouts wouldn't be worth it. The executive worked their magic and got the payouts to a great level considering the numbers and most of those teams have now signed up.


Marc Antoinne: That was a Bassmaster that your dad and his brother fished way back when in their tinny. I was president of OVSB back then and remember the day well.

Ed