Fishing Tournaments

[Wall-I-Guy]

As an American who has vacationed in the Rideau Lakes for almost 30 years, I have only the utmost reverence for your beautiful lakes, wildlife and other natural resources. I am surely not the only Yank to fit this bill.
W.

Shhhhh!...didn't think women like to talk in "years".... You know, the age thing

CB has raised some good points in the previous thread, I'm sure most agree with, including me

[wolfe]

WIG,

Those near-30 yrs are just the ones I've been trekking up to your neck of the woods. There's a "few" more to add on to the grand total, my friend!
But, we'll hush for now...

W.

[grumpy7790]

Here's a few more positives that come from tournament angling:

**Tournament fishing has not only increased the awareness of our fishing resources but added many new anglers to our sport.

**Bass fishing is currently one of the most popular of angling sports. It has created a large industry within itself and the benefits have been important. For example, there's no doubt that competitive bass fishing has brought the tackle industry to new heights, both in tackle improvements and economic power.

**Bass tournaments have played a key role in creating and spreading the great practice of catch and release.

**Tournament fishing has brought more awareness of our fishery resources. Tournament fishing is a great opportunity to get more of the general public involved in the preservation of these great national resources. An elevated awareness would also provide additional sources of funding for preservation projects that desperately need the funds.

**Reduced Limits-almost all tournaments enforce limits that are between 30-50% of the legal limits. This reduces the overall impact to the fishery.

**No Live Bait-again reduces the chances of hookups

**Meet new fellow anglers

**Learn new techniques

**Learn how to become more involved in fishery management

**Economic stimulus to local merchants

G

[Markus]

Sounds like a recruiting pamphlet from a bass anglers association.

[Guest]

*sigh*

I was just about to let sleeping dogs lie, but I can't resist this one.

Nice one Markus! It does sound like a pamphlet.

I'm going to take all these points, and give you the reverse perspective.

**Tournament fishing has not only increased the awareness of our fishing resources but added many new anglers to our sport.

Many new anglers = more pressure. And in a tournament environment, it means more pressure in a confined space. So you increase awareness. More fish are caught, more pressure is placed on the water, and the fish are no better off. From an angler persepctive this is great, but from the perspective of the resource, it certainly is not.

**Bass fishing is currently one of the most popular of angling sports. It has created a large industry within itself and the benefits have been important. For example, there's no doubt that competitive bass fishing has brought the tackle industry to new heights, both in tackle improvements and economic power.

And how many of those in the industry do anything in the way of conservation? 10%? 20%?

**Bass tournaments have played a key role in creating and spreading the great practice of catch and release.

So have outdoor shows, websites, and other media sources, all without pressuring the resource. Do you need 50 boats on a waterway for people to understand the importance of C&R?

**Tournament fishing has brought more awareness of our fishery resources. Tournament fishing is a great opportunity to get more of the general public involved in the preservation of these great national resources. An elevated awareness would also provide additional sources of funding for preservation projects that desperately need the funds.

Additional sources of funding? Greater preservation? Isn't that what this debate is all about? How much of tournament revenues are actually going toward preservation??

**Reduced Limits-almost all tournaments enforce limits that are between 30-50% of the legal limits. This reduces the overall impact to the fishery.

So 50% less fish have to spend their day in a livewell.

**No Live Bait-again reduces the chances of hookups

If you are an inexperienced angler, sure.

**Meet new fellow anglers

I've met hundreds of people on this board, and I didn't need to put 50 boats on a waterbody to do it.

**Learn new techniques

To the advantage of the angler, not the resource.

**Learn how to become more involved in fishery management

For the exception of insisting on C&R , what else are tournaments doing in the way of fishery management??

**Economic stimulus to local merchants

And the fishery is benefiting in what way?

The point is that there are two sides to this story. You can take a stance on either side, and it comes down to the fact that we just don't have the evidence to show what the real impact of tournaments is on a given waterbody. Those for them will advocate that C&R is enough, and that the fishery will only be affected for a matter of days. Those against them will not and will question whether C&R is sufficient.

My stance is very clear. I'm not only opposed to tournaments. I object to any entity, whether it be an individual angler, an organization, or an organized event (profit or non-profit) that uses the resource and doesn't give something back to ensure that resource is maintained. So this goes for all the tackle companies, cruiser boats, jet-skiers, tournament organizers, and individual anglers who do nothing but consume the resources. People are willing to spend hundreds to thousands of dollars on tackle, boats, equipment, and other toys, but when you ask them to give a LITTLE something back to help maintain the resource, you often get the response "Why should I give back anything more than anyone else". My answer: Because you care.

HW

[M.T. Livewell]

Many new anglers = more pressure.

Too many people fishing, tournament guys and non tournament guys. I can solve the pressure problem that the fish are feeling ... EAT THEM ALL!

Now, let me take some of my hard earned tournament money and throw it into the wind. Hopefully it will land in a river somewhere and will help to preserve the fish. But, you weekenders, keep your money, you don't fish tournaments so your money is no good here.

Here is a funny little story, make the democrats non-touney anglers and make the replublicans tourney anglers. It is a funny little parallel.

I hate that someone is trying to pick my pocket just because I have a team number sticker on my outboard.

M.T. Livewell

A young woman was about to finish her first year of college.

Like so many others her age she considered herself to be a very liberal Democrat and was for distribution of all wealth. She felt deeply ashamed that her father was a rather staunch Republican which she expressed openly. One day she was challenging her father on his beliefs and his opposition to higher taxes on the rich and the addition of more government welfare programs. Based on the lectures that she had participated in and the occasional chat with a professor she felt that for years her father had obviously harbored an evil, even selfish desire to keep what he thought should be his.

The self professed objectivity proclaimed by her professors had to be the truth and she indicated so to her father.

He stopped her and asked her point blank, how she was doing in school. She answered rather haughtily that she had a 4.0 GPA, and let him know that it was tough to maintain. That she studied all the time, never had time to go out and party like other people she knew. She didn't even have time for a boyfriend and didn't really have many college friends because of spending all her time studying. That she was taking a more difficult curriculum.

Her father listened and then asked, "How is your good friend Mary doing."

She replied, "Mary is barely getting by". She continued, "She barely has a 2.0 GPA", adding, "and all she takes are easy classes and she never studies." "But Mary is so very popular on campus, college for her is a blast, she goes to all the parties all the time and very often doesn't even show up for classes because she is too hung over."

Her father then asked his daughter, "Why don't you go to the Dean's office and ask him to deduct a 1.0 off your 4.0 GPA and give it to your friend who only has a 2.0." He continued, "That way you will both have a 3.0 GPA and certainly that would be a fair and equal distribution of GPA."

The daughter visibly shocked by her father's suggestion angrily fired back, "That wouldn't be fair! I worked really hard for mine, I did without and Mary has done little or nothing, she played while I worked real hard!"

The father slowly smiled, winked and said, "Welcome to the Republican Party."

[Cancatchbass]

"Many new anglers = more pressure. And in a tournament environment, it means more pressure in a confined space. So you increase awareness. More fish are caught, more pressure is placed on the water, and the fish are no better off. From an angler perspective this is great, but from the perspective of the resource, it certainly is not"

Aw, come on- more pressure? So? Next you'll be condemning this very board, as some of its purposes are 1) to encourage anglers to get out on the water, and 2)educate anglers in waterways and techniques to make their fishing outings more productive, whether fishing tournaments or just fun-fishing. :shock Obviously you, and others, believe that there is too much pressure on our fish stocks. This must be just a gut feeling, as I'm not aware of any hard evidence (or any evidence at all, for that matter) to suggest our fisheries are in serious trouble...

Here's a link that might be useful in this discussion. It explains the Wallop-Breaux fund that has been established in the U.S. for several years. We borrow ideas from south of the border all the time- why not this one?

http://www.wallop-breaux.org/

There is no singling out of tournament anglers in that legislation, though, so HW would be unlikely to support similar legislation in Canada.

What say you HW?

CCB

Sorry, M.T. As soon as I see words like liberal Democrat and right-wing Republicans, my brain shuts off. Some sort of safety mechanism, I think. Couldn't read your story. Could you paraphrase it for me?

[ganman]

I have to agree with CCB on MT's post. Sounds like something from Rush Limbaugh. Dubious and over simpified in the proper context and nothing to do with this thread.

I'd like to see the following criteria met.

1) It's demonstrated you have a facility capable of hosting the event that will not inconvience non tournament anglers and boaters.

2) The lake has a percentage of total acreage/number of participants. Perhaps 100 acres/angler.

3) There is an approved protocol regarding dispursement of released fish. IE: They are not dumped at the weigh site.

4) The upcoming event is posted locally

5) I think some sort of permit or approval should be sought. That way somebody somewhere would have some idea how many tourneys are taking place and where. It'd be easier to track them that way.

I have more but back to work I go

[MichaelVandenberg]

I agree EVERYONE should make attempts to do what THEY CAN to give back to this great natural resource.

So how can one do this? Well we all could just give money to someone or some organization in the hopes that it would be put back into the natural resource.

This is what I do:

1) Don't litter. All garbage stays in the truck or boat till I get home where it is properly disposed of.
2) I recycle to the limits that the city allows (recall they only except 1 and 2 plastic containers now due to the high cost of recycling 3, 4 and 5 plastic containers).
3) I practice catch and release. I don't eat a lot of fish but have when I know a fish won't survive (last time was a 5 lb Pike that was hook in the gills last summer on the Rideau). I am not against people that keep fish to be eaten. It is just not for me.
4) I don't use live bait because I can catch fish using only atrificals, don't like the mess and would like to reduce the chance of hooking any fish to deep (this can still happen with artificals).
5) I use the proper test lines based on location and species to ensure I don't break off fish and leave hooks left in fish,
6) I use a net to bring fish in the boat and make all attempts to ensure they don't flop around,
7) I have the proper tools to remove hooks from fish and take care when removing hooks so the fish isn't damage.
8) I don't gas up my boat in the water and avoid spilling any gas even at the gas station. If a spills occurs I clean it up and ensure all the gas has evaporated before putting the boat in the water.
9) I verify the operation of my live well before every outing
10) I have the live well on constantly when fish are in it and I check on them very regularly (every 30 to 60 min).

Now without spending a cent, the above list shows that I am looking out for our natural resource and shows I care. Should I be doing more? Maybe, but the natural resource is there to be used and SHARED with and by everyone.

Cheers,

Mike...a tournament angler!

[Guest]

Obviously you, and others, believe that there is too much pressure on our fish stocks.

Obviously my point has eluded you once again. Fishing pressure will always exist from both tournament and non-tournament anglers. My criticism is that many of those sources of pressure do little to give anything back.

This must be just a gut feeling, as I'm not aware of any hard evidence (or any evidence at all, for that matter) to suggest our fisheries are in serious trouble...

Nor do you have any evidence to show that it isn't. Again, we're missing the critical facts. Regardless, whether they are or aren't now, there may come a time in the future where they will suffer. Rather than wait, why not do a little something now to prevent the possibility.

The Aquatic Resources Trust Fund is a perfect example. It's the "act after the fact" mentality. Many people died in boat accidents, and the fishing resources suffered substantially before anything was done about either of these issues. Why NOT use this as a perfect example of why we should be doing something now? Case and point. It's a great idea, and a PERFECT time to start thinking about it.

So this goes for all the tackle companies, cruiser boats, jet-skiers, tournament organizers, and individual anglers who do nothing but consume the resources.

I'm singling out tournament anglers?? Believe me, the rest are on my list.

HW

[ganman]

CCB I just reread your post....

You have to give some credence to the idea that there is some short term negative effect from angling pressure. I agree long term likely none. When it comes to bass we have 2 months where pressure is moderate to heavy tapering off to nothing.

I hit might be wrong but this bass season I had the perception alot of water I fished had been worked over pretty hard. I couldn't avoid tournaments it seemed. If I had of known I would have avoided those waters.

[MichaelVandenberg]

If just one non tournament boater using a public ramp is inconvienced by your tourney than sorry boys time to find another place to hold your tournament.

Very disturbing opinion.

I have been inconvienced by PWC, pleasure boaters and fellow anglers at launches numerous times. Having to wait for a bunch of boats to be launched or waiting for someone having difficulty can be trying. Do I think they shouldn't be able to use the launch cause of this. No. Do they have the same rights as me? Yes.

I agree launches can be crowded by tournaments. It also can be frustrating for everyone including tournament anglers. Patience, patience, patience.

Launches are for the public. Everyone pays the same launch fees to use the launch.

Don't like the crowds, build a private launch that no one else can use.

Cheers,

Mike

[ganman]

"A disturbing opinion"

A poor choice of words my friend. Not agreeable to your opinion yes...disturbing no.

You are holding a private group function at a public facilty. What would the reaction be if a car club put on a car show at a municipal parking lot without advance notice? Legal? Maybe, maybe not. How would those who use that lot regularly feel?

Those others you stated are individuals not a group. Quite a distinction no matter how they inconvenience you.

[Cancatchbass]

I sure am glad I was sent home early from work today because of the weather.

probassing- I too shuddered when I read the sentence you quoted. I didn't respond to it, though, as I don't want to wage battles on too many fronts at the same time- classic military mistake.

The idea that if 50 (example only) boats are using a launch (that are taking part in some kind of organized event) should be compelled to leave if a single, non-event boater shows up hopefully is not the message ganman meant to convey. Besides, haven't we all agreed that tournament organizations, out of simple courtesy, should be required to post their intention of holding a tournament at the ramp(s) they will be using. This will also benefit the organizations, possibly) by generating interest and possibly more of an audience for their weigh-ins. Would this help solve your problem, ganman? Again, with the exception of Renegade Bass and possibly BAOO, there are usually no more than a handful of boats in most of the tournaments held in "our" waters. With the possible exception of the marauding gang that comes in the night from across the T.I. bridge, that is.

On the subject of dumping fish at the ramp, there is NEVER an excuse for this practice. Obviously (I've got to stop using that word) most tournament organizations cannot afford live-release boats such as Renegade Bass uses (bought and maintained by the members, by the way). Whenever I fish a tournament that does not have that luxury, I insist on returning the fish to my livewell after weighing in and then ferrying them to suitable spots on the lake/river myself. I often take the fish back to the very areas from which they were caught.

Another thing- there is a movement underway to manage all organized fishing events in the province. I attended the initial meeting in Toronto last spring, representing some local tournament organizations, and a lot of good info was shared and the groundwork layed to get the organization up and running. The idea was to be pro-active to the point that we wouldn't be faced with the government imposing restrictions on tournament anglers ala the gun registry. No-one could want another one of those fiascos. The one industry representative that was present and putting their $$$ into this organization was Shimano Canada.

I have not yet decided whether I personally fully support this concept, and don't know if I trust some of the heavy hitters behind this movement- hidden agendas?

ganman- I believe that I did concede that there would be short-term negative effects on the fishing after a tournament. I know I would rather fish untouched waters than those that had been hit hard by dozens of other anglers in the preceeding 1-2 days. Again, though, if we can get the posting deal going, this can be largely avoided. Hopefully.

Here's another good thing. With the exception of a few end-of-the-season, last-kick-at-the-can type events, most tournament series are all but done by labour day. And most of the tubers and PWC yahoos are gone for the season. Problem solved until next July!

CCB

[spinner]

The idea that if 50 (example only) boats are using a launch (that are taking part in some kind of organized event) should be compelled to leave if a single, non-event boater shows up hopefully is not the message ganman meant to convey. Besides, haven't we all agreed that tournament organizations, out of simple courtesy, should be required to post their intention of holding a tournament at the ramp(s) they will be using. This will also benefit the organizations, possibly) by generating interest and possibly more of an audience for their weigh-ins. Would this help solve your problem, ganman? Again, with the exception of Renegade Bass and possibly BAOO, there are usually no more than a handful of boats in most of the tournaments held in "our" waters. With the possible exception of the marauding gang that comes in the night from across the T.I. bridge, that is.

CCB

I agree that it is an issue when non-tournament boaters go to a ramp only to find parking is full or it is very busy and if fishing find that the lake has lots of boats on it. It is a good idea that there sould be postings at the ramps however I feel that the operators of the ramps should take much of the blame(be it private or municipally run) and the tournaments organizations could also help while the ramp operators are in the BEST position to do so. I believe that the tournaments(at least most larger ones that create the issues) have to get permits and/or special permission in most cases to use the ramps(and usually well in advance) and also pay for their tournaments useage of the ramp and parking. I would think that the operators/owners of the ramps in question(being paid for it's use) should be considerate enough to their regular paying customers to post a listing of the various dates and tournaments that will be at their ramp for the year.