I wanted to ask Ganman a couple of questions about what he wrote in the "What are the Salmon and Chateaugay Like These Days?" thread. It was getting so long, though, that I thought I would start a new one.
Ganman, you wrote about wild fish around Titus/Chasm Falls.
Are they all brookies or are there any browns up there?
As for me, I have been back down to the Salmon/Chateaguay three times recently. I wrote a big long novel about a couple of the trips, hit "Submit", and lost it into cyberspace. I'm keeping this one short.
The fishing was satisfying each time. One time, I got enough of those abusive trout who rise all around me below the Sam Cook bridge to feel that they can no longer bully me. On Saturday night, though, they toyed with me a fair bit.
There have been a lot of white flies (leukons?) flying above the water, but they almost never land on the water. Emergers have caught me a few rainbows, but they seem to be feeding on flies too small to see, especially as it becomes darker.
I am thinking of trying midges there. I've never done that before. Any thoughts about the prospects of success?
The highlight of the last three trips was walking down to a hole well below the Sam Cook bridge on Saturday night in the dark (a reasonably stupid thing to do, but not as bad as I thought it would be) and catching a 21-inch brown at 9:30 p.m. on a Matuka.
I want more.
I'll stop now in case this posting is going to disappear like my last ones. I hope to hear more from others about the area around Chasm Falls, as well as any other information about these two rivers or the prospect for larger browns.
Manfred
More on the Salmon and Chateauguay
I'm inclined to think the trout you saw feeding were eating spinners and not midges.
Okay what are spinners?.....No no not Mepps or Panther Martins.
Spinners are mayflies hatched on previous nights and have come back to the river to complete their lifecycle. The last thing a mayfly does is mate, lay eggs (females of course) then die all within minutes.
They are called spinners because of the rythmic up and down manner of flight. It is common to see great numbers flying upstream long before they actually do there thing. With most types of mayflies the actual spinner fall takes place over riffles which may be why you didn't see anything on the surface if you were fishing a pool. Of course spinners drift down to the pool and that is the place to be. Spinners usually lay flat on the water with there wings flush on the suface and are difficult to see.
Since they are not going to get away trout take spinners with a very delicate sipping take. Big trout make no more disturbance than a tiny minnow. More aggressive rises usually mean they taking caddis or hatching mayflies.
If your on the water early in the morning try a spinner imitation. Its likely the last thing a trout ate the night before and some are still looking for them in the morning. Look at the back eddies where they end up. Sometimes you'll see what looks like a minnow feeding in a shallow backwater with delicate little sips. Sometimes it is a little chub but sometimes its a big trout eating leftovers. It's very exacting/stealthy fishing. If you catch trout this way you're well on your way to becoming a master!
Yes they are Ephoron Leukon but I like the simple "white fly" better or Millers as they are sometimes called.
The trout at Titus/Chasm Falls are almost all browns. A few brookies though. Don't look for white flies up here. Too cold. White flies are more associated with warmer, slow sections like downstream or Cooks bridge.
Okay what are spinners?.....No no not Mepps or Panther Martins.
Spinners are mayflies hatched on previous nights and have come back to the river to complete their lifecycle. The last thing a mayfly does is mate, lay eggs (females of course) then die all within minutes.
They are called spinners because of the rythmic up and down manner of flight. It is common to see great numbers flying upstream long before they actually do there thing. With most types of mayflies the actual spinner fall takes place over riffles which may be why you didn't see anything on the surface if you were fishing a pool. Of course spinners drift down to the pool and that is the place to be. Spinners usually lay flat on the water with there wings flush on the suface and are difficult to see.
Since they are not going to get away trout take spinners with a very delicate sipping take. Big trout make no more disturbance than a tiny minnow. More aggressive rises usually mean they taking caddis or hatching mayflies.
If your on the water early in the morning try a spinner imitation. Its likely the last thing a trout ate the night before and some are still looking for them in the morning. Look at the back eddies where they end up. Sometimes you'll see what looks like a minnow feeding in a shallow backwater with delicate little sips. Sometimes it is a little chub but sometimes its a big trout eating leftovers. It's very exacting/stealthy fishing. If you catch trout this way you're well on your way to becoming a master!
Yes they are Ephoron Leukon but I like the simple "white fly" better or Millers as they are sometimes called.
The trout at Titus/Chasm Falls are almost all browns. A few brookies though. Don't look for white flies up here. Too cold. White flies are more associated with warmer, slow sections like downstream or Cooks bridge.
Last edited by ganman on Tue Sep 04, 2007 1:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The very best spinner imitation .........PERIOD!!
Seriously tried them all but nothing works as well as this simple fly.
Hook: favourite light wire dry fly hook in sizes to imitate natural.
Tail: split pontoon tails ("V" shaped) 1 1/2 times the shank length.
Body: Fine dubbing, colour to suit natural although many spinners are rusty brown.
Hackle: slightly longer then normal dry fly length and clipped at the bottom only. You can see it better left that way and the fish don't mind.
Wing: none
This fly does not twist line like those made with antron wings or other methods. The only mayfly I have found this dosen't work as well for are Green and brown drakes which often hit the water with upright wings.
Seriously tried them all but nothing works as well as this simple fly.
Hook: favourite light wire dry fly hook in sizes to imitate natural.
Tail: split pontoon tails ("V" shaped) 1 1/2 times the shank length.
Body: Fine dubbing, colour to suit natural although many spinners are rusty brown.
Hackle: slightly longer then normal dry fly length and clipped at the bottom only. You can see it better left that way and the fish don't mind.
Wing: none
This fly does not twist line like those made with antron wings or other methods. The only mayfly I have found this dosen't work as well for are Green and brown drakes which often hit the water with upright wings.
-
Little Fox
- Participant
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2007 7:04 am
- Location: Kanata
Name of fly
What was the name of the spinner imitation you described? I'm going to Lake Placid in a couple of weeks and wouldn't mind giving it a try.
Thanks
Thanks
-
Little Fox
- Participant
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2007 7:04 am
- Location: Kanata
Name of fly
What was the name of the spinner imitation you described. I'm going to Lake Placid in a couple of weeks and wouldn't mind giving it a try.
Thanks.
Thanks.
I just got back from Lake Placid this weekend. The water levels are very low and the temperature is still on the high side, making for extremely difficult fishing. The upper stretches above Monument Falls are pretty much unfishable. If the levels haven't risen by the time you get down there your best bets will be to look for the deeper pocket water and plunge pools. If I had the time I would have given the stretch through the notch a try, but we spent more time on the Saranac R. as the water levels there were much better.
Current Hatches:
West Branch:
Tricos, BWOs, Isonychia, Stoneflies (BIG! - size #6-4)
Saranac:
Tricos, BWOs, Isonychia, Stoneflies, little Black Caddis
Current Hatches:
West Branch:
Tricos, BWOs, Isonychia, Stoneflies (BIG! - size #6-4)
Saranac:
Tricos, BWOs, Isonychia, Stoneflies, little Black Caddis
I've often thought the Saranac an equal or better river than the Ausable. Dosen't have the nostalgia or drawing power (is that a bad thing?).
As far as I know that spinner imitation is nameless. The guys who came up with the Comparadun made one similar but I suspect the fly has British roots. Before publishing Canadian Fly Fisher magazine Chris Marshall had a fly shop at his home in Belleville. Chris is from Yorkshire. I bought some he tied for Cold Creek. He was nice enough to teach me about spinners and how to tie them. He put a bright yellow egg sack in some of his.
I've never seen this fly in shops. Most spinner imitations you see in fly shops have antron or some other synthetic material for wings. They work, just not as good and they tend to twist your leader.
As far as I know that spinner imitation is nameless. The guys who came up with the Comparadun made one similar but I suspect the fly has British roots. Before publishing Canadian Fly Fisher magazine Chris Marshall had a fly shop at his home in Belleville. Chris is from Yorkshire. I bought some he tied for Cold Creek. He was nice enough to teach me about spinners and how to tie them. He put a bright yellow egg sack in some of his.
I've never seen this fly in shops. Most spinner imitations you see in fly shops have antron or some other synthetic material for wings. They work, just not as good and they tend to twist your leader.
I had heard there was a fish kill on the Cateaugay last year due to a dam spill. How serious was it and how is it fishing? Hoping to get down for a couple days in September to fish one or both of these rivers. Thanks in advance for any info you might be able to give me
Lots of great info on this site. keep up the great work
Thanks
Lots of great info on this site. keep up the great work
Thanks
Manfred,
Take some scissors and trim of the the bottom fibres of a suitable dry fly so it sits flush on the surface. You could also try a Comparadun, Haystack etc. or simply ask what spinner imitations they have.
Anyone wanting to learn about hatches in the Adirondacks I really recommend Hatch Guide For New England Streams by Thomas Ames Jr. It is a compact little book that fits in your vest but is absolutely loaded with little tidbits and anecdotes for fishing the very northeastern of US streams which so often are ignored in other books.
Take some scissors and trim of the the bottom fibres of a suitable dry fly so it sits flush on the surface. You could also try a Comparadun, Haystack etc. or simply ask what spinner imitations they have.
Anyone wanting to learn about hatches in the Adirondacks I really recommend Hatch Guide For New England Streams by Thomas Ames Jr. It is a compact little book that fits in your vest but is absolutely loaded with little tidbits and anecdotes for fishing the very northeastern of US streams which so often are ignored in other books.
Fished the Salmon and Chateaugay again last night. Wrote another novella about The Big One ("The Young Man and the River"). Hit Send again and had it disappear again.
Did not get to try Ganman's suggestion about cutting the bottom off dries because I could not find a suitable one in my box. More on the way and want to try it soon.
Got another big brown in the dark at the hole way down from Sam Cook, plus a handful of smaller rainbows earlier on the Salmon near lower Flat Rock. A stop there bolsters my ego to face the Taunting Trout below the Sam Cook bridge and whatever may happen farther down.
I wanted to go up near Chasm Falls / Titus earlier in the day but, after consulting my Delorme and the DEC Public Fishing Rights shown on their PDF map on their website, I decided to ask directions here, first:
1. Where around Chasm Falls is there access to the River? Is it only what is shown on the DEC map or are there other spots to park and wade?
2. Perhaps this another question mostly for Gamnan: When you were writing about liking to fish around there, were you talking about above the falls, below the falls, or both?
Needless to say, I'm not looking for people's favourite holes, just where to park and enter the water. The access on the DEC map seems pretty skimpy.
I'm going to end now for fear of having this post disappear, too. I appreciate all the comments from Ganman and everyone else.
Manfred
Did not get to try Ganman's suggestion about cutting the bottom off dries because I could not find a suitable one in my box. More on the way and want to try it soon.
Got another big brown in the dark at the hole way down from Sam Cook, plus a handful of smaller rainbows earlier on the Salmon near lower Flat Rock. A stop there bolsters my ego to face the Taunting Trout below the Sam Cook bridge and whatever may happen farther down.
I wanted to go up near Chasm Falls / Titus earlier in the day but, after consulting my Delorme and the DEC Public Fishing Rights shown on their PDF map on their website, I decided to ask directions here, first:
1. Where around Chasm Falls is there access to the River? Is it only what is shown on the DEC map or are there other spots to park and wade?
2. Perhaps this another question mostly for Gamnan: When you were writing about liking to fish around there, were you talking about above the falls, below the falls, or both?
Needless to say, I'm not looking for people's favourite holes, just where to park and enter the water. The access on the DEC map seems pretty skimpy.
I'm going to end now for fear of having this post disappear, too. I appreciate all the comments from Ganman and everyone else.
Manfred
Since my last one was successfully posted, I'll also write a brief comment on Adams' questioning of the quality of the Chateaguay.
Last summer was the first time I fished there (or fly-fished anywhere). I heard about that spill, too. I caught some fish last year, but many more there this year, and in several different spots on the river. That could mostly be a function of having some idea what I am doing this year.
The water is somewhat lower than it was last year, but that does not bother me too much. For me, it just helps to point out where the holes are and where you might as well keep walking to avoid wasting your time. Compared to last year, I have found this to be helpful.
As for the quality of the water, I don't know about the chemical make-up, but for the last few weeks it has been almost gin-clear and fairly cold. (I think it was about 60F on Saturday night and about 56F by about 11:00 p.m. last night).
M
Last summer was the first time I fished there (or fly-fished anywhere). I heard about that spill, too. I caught some fish last year, but many more there this year, and in several different spots on the river. That could mostly be a function of having some idea what I am doing this year.
The water is somewhat lower than it was last year, but that does not bother me too much. For me, it just helps to point out where the holes are and where you might as well keep walking to avoid wasting your time. Compared to last year, I have found this to be helpful.
As for the quality of the water, I don't know about the chemical make-up, but for the last few weeks it has been almost gin-clear and fairly cold. (I think it was about 60F on Saturday night and about 56F by about 11:00 p.m. last night).
M