While Watertown, NY is the popular (and closest) location for Steelhead from Ottawa, if you have the time and the weather cooperates, I've been told that the Elk River in Western PA is the place to go.
While the fish on average are smaller than what you'll catch on the Salmon R., the sheer numbers make up for the size difference. On the Salmon where you might be lucky to land one or two chromers, you might land 10-15 on the Elk, not to mention all the ones you hook and lose. The other advantage of the Elk is that it's an easy river to wade and lends itself to traditional nymphing rather than the "Chuck-n-Duck" style of the Salmon R.
More on the Salmon and Chateauguay
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Mike Lennox
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- Location: ottawa
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Hey Manfred.....I have really enjoyed reading of your adventures in Upstate New York. I have a question...when does the season close in new york for trout? I spent about 15 minutes looking and did not find it. I must not have been looking the the right place.Manfred wrote:
I spent most of today trying to come to terms with the fact that yesterday might well have been the last trip to the Salmon and the Chateaugay for the year. I can confirm what others have said about the wait for licences in the Malone stores. Between the added time that would entail in buying a new licence and my schedule for the next couple of weeks, yesterday might well have been the end of the season for me.
The Salmon and Chateaugay reopen on 1 April 2008...
Anyways, I am going to New York City for thanksgiving weekend, and I have convinced my parents into letting me fish on the way there and back. If it is closed I'll fish the special regulations section on the AuSable, but I would much rather fish the more productive lesser known waters.
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Mike Lennox
- Silver Participant
- Posts: 625
- Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 7:09 pm
- Location: ottawa
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Reply to Mike -- When the season ends
Mike,
You raise an important question and I should be more clear:
Trout season in the Malone area ends on 15 October 2007. [But you are not entilted to rely on that as legal advice or sue me if I'm wrong.
] Licences (at least mine) expire on 30 September 2007. If you buy a new licence, you can fish until 15 October and then, presumably, from 1 April 2008 until 30 September 2008. [See above about my not being liable for incorrect legal advice.]
As indicated by others in this thread, buying a licence around Malone can take an inordinate amount of time. I looked but could not find any place to buy one between the border and the Malone K-Mart.
[I just wrote, and then deleted, the story of my time-consuming experiece in K-Mart about a month ago with my buddy. I don't want to be sued for slander, either. Even if my defence would be that it was all true, I would still have to subpeona my buddy and he's too busy to fish with me, let alone testify...]
My own personal grief comes from the fact that I am not sure that I have time to both buy a licence and fish before 15 October.
But, you know what? It's 1:30 p.m. and I'm having a rotten day. Screw the office. I'm off to Malone...
You raise an important question and I should be more clear:
Trout season in the Malone area ends on 15 October 2007. [But you are not entilted to rely on that as legal advice or sue me if I'm wrong.
] Licences (at least mine) expire on 30 September 2007. If you buy a new licence, you can fish until 15 October and then, presumably, from 1 April 2008 until 30 September 2008. [See above about my not being liable for incorrect legal advice.]As indicated by others in this thread, buying a licence around Malone can take an inordinate amount of time. I looked but could not find any place to buy one between the border and the Malone K-Mart.
[I just wrote, and then deleted, the story of my time-consuming experiece in K-Mart about a month ago with my buddy. I don't want to be sued for slander, either. Even if my defence would be that it was all true, I would still have to subpeona my buddy and he's too busy to fish with me, let alone testify...]
My own personal grief comes from the fact that I am not sure that I have time to both buy a licence and fish before 15 October.
But, you know what? It's 1:30 p.m. and I'm having a rotten day. Screw the office. I'm off to Malone...
If you had your licence for NYS before you can buy your new licence on-line - takes a couple of minutes. Here is the link: https://nyfgisales.vansis.wcom.com/fgny ... elcome.jsp
As suggested by the trailing lines of my last post, I decided while writing it yesterday afternoon to go fishing. I went to Malone and the Chateaugay and I'm glad I did. In fact, I hope to go again soon.
Now, however, I am pressed for time, so I am just going to state a couple of facts that others may find helpful and ask a couple of questions that may help me if I can get back down there tomorrow.
The water around the Sam Cook Bridge on the Chateaguay from about 5:30 p.m. to well into the evening hovered around 60F.
The level had fallen somewhat since Saturday.
My catch was notably modest, with no big browns. The two little browns I did catch, though, fought hard and jumped fully out of the water at least once each.
Now for my inevitable questions:
1. There were some, but few, Iso's at before about 6:00 p.m. Shortly after that, though, they were flying about almost like clouds. However, there were no rises whatsoever. I took both browns on a dry Iso, but at least the one struck after the fly had sunk below the film. The question, then, is how to catch trout in the middle of such a big hatch, but with no rises?
I think the answer is with an emerger or a wet fly. However, my attempts at this proved futile. My Iso emerger prompted only one strike where the trout missed my fly. I switched to an Iso nymph and got nothing.
2. If the Iso's come off in such numbers about 6:00 p.m. but there is no surface action on the Iso dries, is there a different time of day when they fall and the dries work?
(I might find this out for myself tomorrow if I can get back down).
3. Finally, regarding Mosquito's information that one can renew a licence online, the only reason I did not do that was because I assumed that I would have a lag time of at least several days while I waited for the new to new to arrive in the mail, and thus I figured that I had waited too long. Does the online registration system let you print something by which you can fish immediately?
I ended up going to both K-Mart and Wal-Mart in Malone for my licence. In Wal-Mart, the transaction took me four minutes to be in and out of the store. Since the subject seemed to interest people here, I intended to write in more detail about the experience in both stores. However, I am now really pressed for time. (Gotta fish again tomorrow and all).
I understand that I won't get answers to all all the questions I keep posting here, but I post them in case anyone feels like contributing. The question about fishing in the middle of an Iso hatch when there are no rises is the most important one to me right now, since it tends to cause the most frenzy.
If I don't see anything before I go again, I hope I can report soon on more of my own trial-and-error experiences with emergers, possibly wets, and nymphs.
Manfred
Now, however, I am pressed for time, so I am just going to state a couple of facts that others may find helpful and ask a couple of questions that may help me if I can get back down there tomorrow.
The water around the Sam Cook Bridge on the Chateaguay from about 5:30 p.m. to well into the evening hovered around 60F.
The level had fallen somewhat since Saturday.
My catch was notably modest, with no big browns. The two little browns I did catch, though, fought hard and jumped fully out of the water at least once each.
Now for my inevitable questions:
1. There were some, but few, Iso's at before about 6:00 p.m. Shortly after that, though, they were flying about almost like clouds. However, there were no rises whatsoever. I took both browns on a dry Iso, but at least the one struck after the fly had sunk below the film. The question, then, is how to catch trout in the middle of such a big hatch, but with no rises?
I think the answer is with an emerger or a wet fly. However, my attempts at this proved futile. My Iso emerger prompted only one strike where the trout missed my fly. I switched to an Iso nymph and got nothing.
2. If the Iso's come off in such numbers about 6:00 p.m. but there is no surface action on the Iso dries, is there a different time of day when they fall and the dries work?
(I might find this out for myself tomorrow if I can get back down).
3. Finally, regarding Mosquito's information that one can renew a licence online, the only reason I did not do that was because I assumed that I would have a lag time of at least several days while I waited for the new to new to arrive in the mail, and thus I figured that I had waited too long. Does the online registration system let you print something by which you can fish immediately?
I ended up going to both K-Mart and Wal-Mart in Malone for my licence. In Wal-Mart, the transaction took me four minutes to be in and out of the store. Since the subject seemed to interest people here, I intended to write in more detail about the experience in both stores. However, I am now really pressed for time. (Gotta fish again tomorrow and all).
I understand that I won't get answers to all all the questions I keep posting here, but I post them in case anyone feels like contributing. The question about fishing in the middle of an Iso hatch when there are no rises is the most important one to me right now, since it tends to cause the most frenzy.
If I don't see anything before I go again, I hope I can report soon on more of my own trial-and-error experiences with emergers, possibly wets, and nymphs.
Manfred
Manfred,
Isonychias are unique to other mayflies. Some mayflies like March Browns, Cahills, Grey Foxes are clingers. They live on the underside of rocks, hence their flat shape and large muscular legs for clinging. The hendrickson lives in the dead spaces between rocks. It is more agile and active than the previous nymphs. It is not so flat and the legs are less predominant. The green, brown and yellow drakes are burrowers. They are long with large pronouced gills to capture as much oxygen as possible in the sediment.
Isonychias on the other hand are swimmers. They prefer fast water. They are very agile like small minnows. Legs are useless so they have very tiny legs but they are streamlined and muscular with a pronounced tail. They do not emerge per se like other mayflies. When available the nymph swims to a mid stream boulders, crawls above the water and sheds its nymph shuck into an adult dun. When boulders are not present they will swim to shallow areas, logs etc to emerge. Look for the nymph husks on streamside rocks. Knowing all this it is no wonder they are the longest and most important hatch on swift rocky Adirondack rivers.
Emerging flies are not important. HOWEVER because they are big flies that hatch all day and weak fliers, in a strong fall breeze many end up back in the water and trout are on the look out for them. The Dun Variant fly came about for this very reason.
Since the nymph swims like a minnow and heads for the shore to emerge then traditional nymphing techniques won't work. The time honored technique is to fish a size 10 Leadwing Coachman wetfly with short quick strips around instream boulders. I said this once before here. Keep your tippets 3X. They hit this fly very hard in fast water.
When fishing this hatch pattern is less important than how and where you fish.
The clouds of flies you saw in the early evening were likely....once again spinners.
After the Iso's are done you have one last hurrah but a very good one at that. Tie up some #18,20 Olives. Dark drizzly fall days are best. You should get action from late morning thru the afternoon. You can leave the river before dark and be home early. I used to stop on the way home and have a few brews and a nice meal. Was a gereat way to cap off the season.
Isonychias are unique to other mayflies. Some mayflies like March Browns, Cahills, Grey Foxes are clingers. They live on the underside of rocks, hence their flat shape and large muscular legs for clinging. The hendrickson lives in the dead spaces between rocks. It is more agile and active than the previous nymphs. It is not so flat and the legs are less predominant. The green, brown and yellow drakes are burrowers. They are long with large pronouced gills to capture as much oxygen as possible in the sediment.
Isonychias on the other hand are swimmers. They prefer fast water. They are very agile like small minnows. Legs are useless so they have very tiny legs but they are streamlined and muscular with a pronounced tail. They do not emerge per se like other mayflies. When available the nymph swims to a mid stream boulders, crawls above the water and sheds its nymph shuck into an adult dun. When boulders are not present they will swim to shallow areas, logs etc to emerge. Look for the nymph husks on streamside rocks. Knowing all this it is no wonder they are the longest and most important hatch on swift rocky Adirondack rivers.
Emerging flies are not important. HOWEVER because they are big flies that hatch all day and weak fliers, in a strong fall breeze many end up back in the water and trout are on the look out for them. The Dun Variant fly came about for this very reason.
Since the nymph swims like a minnow and heads for the shore to emerge then traditional nymphing techniques won't work. The time honored technique is to fish a size 10 Leadwing Coachman wetfly with short quick strips around instream boulders. I said this once before here. Keep your tippets 3X. They hit this fly very hard in fast water.
When fishing this hatch pattern is less important than how and where you fish.
The clouds of flies you saw in the early evening were likely....once again spinners.
After the Iso's are done you have one last hurrah but a very good one at that. Tie up some #18,20 Olives. Dark drizzly fall days are best. You should get action from late morning thru the afternoon. You can leave the river before dark and be home early. I used to stop on the way home and have a few brews and a nice meal. Was a gereat way to cap off the season.
BEWARE -- EXTENDED SEASON LIMITED TO CERTAIN WATER
Mike,
A friend reminded me today that the season that is extended until 15 October is limited to certain water. This includes, he said, the Salmon and the Chateaguay.
I just got back from both. Thanks once again to Ganman for his advice. I drove around this morning looking for leadwing coachmen.
The fishing was pretty slow, although I got a few. What with it being 00:40, I'm too tired to make much of a story out of it right now.
Manfred
A friend reminded me today that the season that is extended until 15 October is limited to certain water. This includes, he said, the Salmon and the Chateaguay.
I just got back from both. Thanks once again to Ganman for his advice. I drove around this morning looking for leadwing coachmen.
The fishing was pretty slow, although I got a few. What with it being 00:40, I'm too tired to make much of a story out of it right now.
Manfred