photographing OOS fish

[Guest]

It's great to see a few tournament organizers and tackle manufacturers taking a proactive approach toward C&R fishing. Hopefully more of the big names will follow suit in due course.

HW

P.S. Someone stole my popcorn and soda................

[jazman]

Anyone who refers to data in the plural (ie. these data) is ok in my books.

I remain open to the possibility to the fact that OOS pics do harm to the fish... put me in water for any amount of time when I cannot breathe and I am being harmed. Relative to the damage ALL anglers do to a population of fish through deep hooksets, escessive playing, driving a hook through its mouth often tearing open hole (think paper thin crappie for ex.) etc. I feel the effects are no more severe than the few examples i have offered and the many more that exist.

I will however, continue to read the information made available by you folks and keep my mind open.

[Mikey]

Mikey, I was careful only to cite articles published in peer-reviewed scholarly journals - never perfect but the best system we have for weeding out personal agendas, bad design and flawed reasoning. Such journals are held in higher esteem than government published documents (the so-called "gray-literature").

Ray Scott, the founder of B.A.S.S. has more confidence in the findings (reduced air exposure reduces mortality) and innovations of the Tufts lab than do some of our "common sense" driven Fish-Hawkers. (I hope we're all still smiling...I am).

Canadians should be proud of the following:
”

Michael, that's the beauty of a democracy and free speech.....each individual gets to come his own conclusions...hats off to Ray for his initiative....and respect for his opinion.....insert smiley here

Mikey

[CNs]

try this next time you are fishing or watching a fishing show.

The minute you/they remove the fish out of the water hold your breath. If you can't hold it for as long as the fish is out of the water, imagine how the fish feels.

I have done this. I can hold my breath for about 3 miutes before I get really uncomfortable. It sure makes you work the hook out quicker and take faster pics.


You will also realize that the fishing show hosts hold the fish out a long time.

Good topic michael

[big-o]

Mikey Wrote:

don't see the relationship between poaching and hooking an OOS bass, taking it's picture and putting it back. You haven't taken the fish...nor killed it....personally....if anyone sees me taking a picture of a bass that I hooked while fishing Walleye or pike, returning it to the water .....and comes over and calls me a poacher??? I hope you are ready for a SERIOUS confrontation. I have a big problem with people who run around telling anglers they have broken their code of fishing ethics...when they themselves have many skeltons in their own closet...JP...you have NEVER taken a picture of an OOS fish you accidently hooked?? Either you are the exception ....or not caught many fish....I am gulity as charged I guess....and contrary to the study....I will take a picture of a 6 pound smallmouth if I accidently hook one. You say you don't want to ruffle any feathers with your comment....my grandfather taught me a valuable lesson when I was 12.....( try this excercise) he said ...take your index finger and point at someone...accuse them or judge them...he then said..now look at your other 3 fingers....who are they pointing at? Not meant to ruffle any feathers...

[Legend]

I appreciate science, I work in a scientific capacity. But I'm also aware of my surroundings.

The scientific reports have value in the aggregate and generally address a specific issue, but I wonder...

Most things in nature that are put under reasonable stress actually flourish. Plants that are pruned tend to flower better, and even human beings need certain stressors to develop. Stress can be a good thing, hence the saying: "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger."

I guess the point here is how fragile are Bass or any fish species for that matter and what are their tolerances for stress?

If Bass have become so intolerant to being airborne that their very existence is threatened, and if the science truly determines that specific issue, it may well be time to impose a ban on their catch altogether. It may also be time to look at ways of genetically toughening the species to ensure their survival.

As far as OOS pics are concerned, I respect the right of every angler to make their own decision until the ministry is able to consistently enforce the regs. Personally, I don't take pics of OOS fish.

Legend

[SkeeterJohn]

The minute you/they remove the fish out of the water hold your breath. If you can't hold it for as long as the fish is out of the water, imagine how the fish feels.

Fish aren't humans and trying to compare fish out of water to humans holding their breath isn't a valid example.

Consider what a fish goes through on it's way to being unhooked.. we don't see complaints about ripping hooks through their mouths.. dragging them out of their environment and fighting them to near exhaustion.. but for some reason some of us take it really personal when we mention carefully taking a photograph... Anyone see the nonsense in that

There's been some good replies in here but perhaps we should remind ourselves that bass aren't the only species that have a season although it's no surprise to me that they're the first fish to be held in high regard above all others.

[Buzzer]

I used to work for a well-known statistician who contracted for the government. He used to joke, "If you can't prove your point with statistics you need more statistics".

I now always take any stats/research I read very lightly. We all have the right to our own opinion; just don't go too far to the left or right or it may "come back to haunt you" years later.

Buzzer

[Mikey]

John....you'd better change your signature

[Guest]

If you can't prove your point with statistics you need more statistics

It's funny that we have undeniable statistics surrounding the detrimental and life threatening effects of smoking, yet a large amount of the population still choose to smoke. I know it's a far cry comparing fishing to smoking, but the point is still the same. For some people, no amount of evidence or research will ever make a difference.

In both cases, it is freedom of choice. Make the decision that is right for you and makes you comfortable.

HW

[Buzzer]

In both cases, it is freedom of choice. Make the decision that is right for you and makes you comfortable.

Super Cool

Just want to say that going to far to the "left" or the "right" can be embarrassing sometimes when one reflects back......


Buzzer

[Trophymuskie]

This is a great topic and definatly not the same old same old. Now these studies have proven that taking fish out of water after a simulated fight was showing more damage then with fish not taken out of water after the fight. Naturally this is damaging to bass before spawn and causing undeveloped eggs but the message here is that this is bad for all fish taken out of water anytime of the year and not only OOS fish.

I am glad to see science prove that what we have been preaching is a good thing ( or is that a better thing ). We in the muskie communitee have been trying to keep our out of water time to a minimal and that is under 15 seconds.

Now I am really starting to believe that water releasing is the next step in C&R.

[Buzzer]

[JP]

Mikey wrote;

I have a big problem with people who run around telling anglers they have broken their code of fishing ethics...when they themselves have many skeltons in their own closet...JP...you have NEVER taken a picture of an OOS fish you accidently hooked?? Either you are the exception ....or not caught many fish....

Mikey and everyone, Sorry If I come off strong and you are right Mikey that I am guilty of once taking pics of out of season fish, but I have not in a many years and will never again. What changed my ways, don't know, but all I can say is that I don't agree with the practice. I am sorry to all I have offended by calling it poaching, not the right term to use. I just see so many people abusing the environment by pulling fish off beds and not caring. This is why I will never fish a tournament anywhere where it targets spawning fish in early season.
Just my 2 cents I guess.
Cheers
JP

[grumpy7790]

If taking a fish out of water is just too much stress for them to handle.........then they should try a 60 hour work week, pay a big mortgage, provide for three kids and a wife!

Anybody overly concerned about my stress???

LOL,

G