Deer Population sucks

Post by **Hookup** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:09 pm

Was out tonight for a hunt in the snow... first time since the snow on Wednesday.... 8 separate tracks in a 1.4mile walk... Most right around one area, where easily one or two individuals could have accounted for three or more tracks...

I'm frustrated at the lack of population... the next 5 years are going to be rough...

I'n 7 years of hunting, I've never been skunked.. but this year, looks like my first blank is about to be served...

Post by **TLunge** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 10:24 pm

That sucks Hookup, some of my hunting areas were like you described but luckily my main area had good numbers and we bagged a few. I talked to some other hunters that did well from various areas so there are some good pockets with good populations around.
From what I hear the prime MONEY! areas are still good but if your hunting area is a secondary or not that prime of an area things are very tough.
We are spoiled though, this year was still better than any year in the 50's, 60's,70's 80's and probably half of the 90's
I saw alot of fawns this year (in the good area) so hopefully things will improve soon.

Post by **Out4trout** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 10:34 pm

Numbers are down all over, PQ as well.

We lucked out this year, by hunting in an area where there were still good numbers.

I think with the deer population being down, the rifle season next year ought to be decreased back to 1 week and tag issue should be cut in 1/2 next year. I'd be OK with both for a year... to help a recovery in the population.

Post by **Jimmy_1** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 11:46 am

Went out Saturday in the snow and be blown down on the way back out we saw fresh tracks cross ours....

I agree numbers are down and now its more luck than anything.

J

Post by **MLR** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:49 pm

Well my sad story from the camp goes like this. On Saturday didn't see a thing. Sunday a fawn was 30 yds away, and was waiting for it to turn broadside, when out of the corner of my eye, i see something. Its the 10 point buck that eluded us at the camp all fall (we have hundreds of pics from trail cams) There he is, 15 yds away and not a damned thing I can do about it, cause if i turn towards him, he will run. After 10 minutes (seemed like an hour) he turns and walks back out the way came. That spooked the fawn, it ran away.

Post by **orrsey** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 12:48 pm

Do the deer from that area herd up?

Post by **Hookup** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 12:39 pm

TLunge wrote:That sucks Hookup, some of my hunting areas were like you described but luckily my main area had good numbers and we bagged a few. I talked to some other hunters that did well from various areas so there are some good pockets with good populations around.
From what I hear the prime MONEY! areas are still good but if your hunting area is a secondary or not that prime of an area things are very tough.
We are spoiled though, this year was still better than any year in the 50's, 60's,70's 80's and probably half of the 90's
I saw alot of fawns this year (in the good area) so hopefully things will improve soon.

I think, that the "good spots" have had some benifit from responsible hunters as well... The two groups I now hunt with have a "brown its down" policy... and the population now sucks... with so many doe-tags for the past few years available this style of hunting has hurt the bush big-time...

In a previous area I hunting, it was managed harvest and trophy hunting... That area is still producing like a champ and everyone is getting their deer just as before...

I do think MNR should step-in and reduce the gun-week to 1 week at a minimum. They should also really cut-down on the tags and in some areas completely eliminate the antlerless tags for a few years. In fact, I'd say better harvest management is mroe important than shorter gun weeks... but a bit of both might go a long way.

Additionally, putting a bounty on the coyottes would also help...

Post by **Buckshot** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 7:05 pm

I dont think we could ever knock the wolf/coyote population down enought that it would have a big benifit for the deer.

I think have to focus on hoping the winter is an easy winter on deer, and maybe look at what agriculture and foresty practices we have on the landscape that will benifit deer and other wildlife should we experience some harsh winters in the future.

Just my two cents.

I have seen a number of deer this year i never shot but i had several bucks within range just nothing that i was interested in.

THere are pockets of deer out there and in some areas with the colder weather and snow you have realy started to see them migrate to wintering areas.

Good luck

Post by **charbyc** » Sun Dec 27, 2009 10:05 pm

you know i cant help thinking the big bucks are getting shot out......

the ten point trophy rack that everyone wants on their wall would be the reason for a shortage of good breeders....

im a meat hunter and generally take a smaller one... but to see a guy shoot a nice eight or ten point buck for the points makes me sick. i know guys that go hunt and give away the meat... they just want to big boy roaming the bush.

the province controling the doe hunt has been a great idea but maybe we shoot limit antler tags for a year or two.....

all i saw this year were does and fawns....... no doe tag so no meat this year lads!

just a thought.....

wolves aint helping much either on my chunk of land you can hear a large pack every night.....

Post by **Roughneck1860** » Mon Dec 28, 2009 5:46 pm

Buckshot wrote:I dont think we could ever knock the wolf/coyote population down enought that it would have a big benifit for the deer.

Not trying to stir the pot here but we sure the heck could depending on the area. In areas where there are high snow fall amounts and large wolf and coyote populations they can easily target pregnant does late in the winter when they are having a hard time getting around in the deep snow. Each pregnant does means two or three less the next year which turns into 5 or 6 after two years and 6 or 8 after three years. I actually did a paper on this back in the '80's for school.

Tim

Post by **TLunge** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:31 am

You may be able to knock it down a bit temporarily to give deer some breathing room in the late winter/spring. Coyotes in neighboring areas will just have larger litters though and re-populate the area pretty quickly.

Post by **charbyc** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:07 am

so every township should put a bounty on wolves then......

we own a farm and deer arent the only thing those wolves like to eat.

if there was a bounty out for them or at least a season maybe we could cull their numbers....

i know its all cyclical though maybe we could just hurry it through the high point for the wolves.

just thoughts, but if the wolves get bad and farmers start losing livestock your dam right theyre gonna get shot.

Post by **Buckshot** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:40 am

I am going to suggest it would have to be the management of the deer from a habitat and human stand point i dont think predator managament will have the effect we all would like.

It has been proven time and time again that coyotes/wolves will adapt to hunting and trapping presure.

I think the most reliable manager is mother nature she seems to keep the checks and balances in place and keeps things going the correct manner.

Through most of ontario our deer #s seem to be down based on what everyone is saying and i think this is directly related to two hard winters with deep snow and extended cold as a result starvation and predators took there toll on the wildlife. I think ulitmatly better habitat management would help to avert some of this, more food equels more wildlife, more cover equels more wildlife etc.

http://www.ecoissues.ca/wiki//index.php ... _Predators

if you can get to this link it is interesting.

i am just not as computer savy as i would like

Post by **Roughneck1860** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:15 am

Deer and habit management are large issues in helping the heard. So are predator management. I guess it boils down to it not being "X" factor harming the heard but "X", "Y" and "Z" factors managed together to help things. We have a local group that works on all three factors on private land and it made quite a noticable difference. If the areas mentioned above are privately own it might be worth talking with land owners about habit and feeding programs as well as allowing predator hunts during the off season.

Good Huntin'
Tim

Post by **Buckshot** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 2:36 pm

Tim

Most of the area that is discussed above is in the Ottawa Valley area andis composed of private and crown land with very large tracks of bush.

I am making the asumption that you are in the windsor chatham area nd the land base is a bit different.

But i agree in that we need several factors to come together and help out the deer herd.